tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1015949969530867456.post5039268921003966874..comments2024-01-09T15:49:37.273-05:00Comments on THE TENTH CRUSADE: Anyone peppersprayed at the New Translation?TTChttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08738875888053745269noreply@blogger.comBlogger8125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1015949969530867456.post-44108620502121548202011-11-28T20:03:57.525-05:002011-11-28T20:03:57.525-05:00Thanks for the links. I will catch up with them ov...Thanks for the links. I will catch up with them over the next few days. I should have been more clear this morning that I am not empathetic to sloppy translation. You would think somebody over there would see the flaws and fix them so the syntax would unambiguously point to the mysteries. But for those of us suffering the insufferable, this is a huge improvement.<br /><br />Re: the kiss of peace. It will go. It's already gone in some strong pockets of orthodoxy (like Virginia). In the meantime, we should probably just continue to quietly maintain our intimacy with Christ and the mystical at that critical moment in the Mass and let the thing die a natural death.TTChttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08738875888053745269noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1015949969530867456.post-60770616444738022932011-11-28T17:11:56.609-05:002011-11-28T17:11:56.609-05:00More on the shortcomingd of the new translaiton:
...More on the shortcomingd of the new translaiton:<br /><br />Informed of multiple errors, Congregation for Divine Worship did little or nothing <br /><br />May 1, 2011 <br />http://www.praytellblog.com/index.php/2011/05/01/the-2010-received-text-the-internal-report-and-the-final-text/ <br /><br />You still remember the Gray Book and the Received Text and the number 10,000 and the internal report “Areas of Difficulty,” right? How’s that? You want a refresher? OK, here we go. <br /><br />The Gray Book is the final version of the missal translation ICEL sends to the national bishops’ conferences, after having worked for many years with the conferences in developing it. Then the conferences approve the Gray Book, sometimes as is, sometimes with a few amendments, and send it to Rome for recognitio (= approval). <br /><br />Last summer the story leaked that Rome allowed a few people on Vox Clara to redo the final text. They made over 10,000 changes – introducing all sorts of mistranslations, contorted English, and even theological errors. Since Vox Clara had received every draft translation over the previous years with opportunity to give feedback, it was especially puzzling that they held back all the way through, and then at the last stage undid and redid whatever they wanted. <br /><br />Perhaps we’ll never know who was responsible for this mischief, but in some circles they speak of the Missale Moronicum. Its other name is the “Received Text” – the text received by Pope Benedict at a luncheon on April 28, 2010 with Msgr. James Moroney and everyone else from Vox Clara. <br /><br />Xavier Rindfleisch wrote four articles for Pray Tell (part one, part two, part three, and part four) comparing the ICEL 2008 Gray Book text to the 2010 Received Text. <br /><br />Enter the internal report, “Areas of Difficulty in the Received Text of the Roman Missal,” reported on by Pray Tell and later leaked by someone on WikiSpooks. Whoever wrote it – we’re sure it’s someone within the translation machinery – knows his stuff. The internal report is a devastating critique of the problems in the Received Text. <br /><br />The final text which will appear in our missals next November has been leaked at WikiSpooks. <br /><br />Put these three things together: <br />* the Received Text, <br />* the internal report showing the problems in the Received Text, <br />* and the final text, <br />and you have a rare opportunity to examine how Rome responds to highly competent critique of its work. Does the final text correct the problems? Does it address the grave concerns of the report? <br /><br />Pray Tell is happy to report that Xavier Rindfleisch is back! And he has done exactly this work. He lays out in summary form each problem identified in the internal report, noting whether or not the problem is corrected in the final text. See Xavier’s full report here: <br /><br />“The 2010 Received Text, the Internal Report, and the Final Text” by Xavier Rindfleisch [ http://www.praytellblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/Xavier-Rindfleish-Comparing-Received-and-Final1.pdf ].Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1015949969530867456.post-11332148753433797192011-11-28T13:00:01.663-05:002011-11-28T13:00:01.663-05:00For the most part I like the, but they changed som...For the most part I like the, but they changed some things that should not have been changed and sound very awkward (i.e. the last line of the Creed).<br /><br />I thought that this would have been a good time to correct a lot of things all around - for instance, this silly hand-holding and/or orans position of the people during the Our Father, and the excessive nonsense during the abhorrent "Kiss of Peace". However, not a peep from the priests.<br /><br />Am glad, though, to once again hear "for many" instead of "for all". That in itself was a great victory.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1015949969530867456.post-50387335047033676682011-11-28T11:41:10.892-05:002011-11-28T11:41:10.892-05:00Carol,
The pastor of my parish announced that &qu...Carol,<br /><br />The pastor of my parish announced that "sign of peace", as practiced for the last 40 years or so eg.shaking hands, backslapping and yucking it up with your homies, was headed for the dustbin of history. Yet on Sunday it reared it's head like the monsters that won't die in horror films.<br /><br />The Magnificat missalette says in parenthesis "when appropriate". It won't be easy to change 70s fossilized "progressive" priests, what's the deal???breathnachhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12308036185276331387noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1015949969530867456.post-57401009072545904372011-11-28T10:44:54.190-05:002011-11-28T10:44:54.190-05:00I LOVE them too! Pretty easy to learn since I nev...I LOVE them too! Pretty easy to learn since I never stopped saying them the "old way" especially the prayer before receiving Communion. Now all we need is for them to turn the Altar facing God and kneeling for Communion & the Church will make the front page of the Globe again! So nice of them to let us know what's going on at Mass, even made the 11pm news on ch 5 woo hooo... I'm sure they hoped to stir up trouble.kdnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1015949969530867456.post-67374825551423535822011-11-28T08:10:12.208-05:002011-11-28T08:10:12.208-05:00I don't see anyone in their right mind compreh...I don't see anyone in their right mind comprehending the prayer that way. I would not wring my hands over it Martha.TTChttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08738875888053745269noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1015949969530867456.post-2820720073568510012011-11-28T07:49:24.296-05:002011-11-28T07:49:24.296-05:00I give two cheers to the new translation. We hear...I give two cheers to the new translation. We heard one of its many shortcoming in the Prayer after Communion for the First Sunday of Advent, which reads:<br /><br />May these mysteries, O Lord,<br />in which we have participated, profit us, we pray, for even now, as we walk amid passing things, you teach us by them to love the things of heaven and hold fast to what endures.<br /><br />The problem is that “them” seems to refer to “passing things,” as if we should make use of transitory and superficial things to learn to love heavenly things. <br />A check of the Latin text and the earlier (2008) version of the translation shows that “them” refers to “mysteries” way up in the first line:<br /><br />Prosint nobis, quaesumus, Domine, frequentata mysteria, quibus nos, inter praetereuntia ambulantes,<br />iam nunc instituis amare caelestia et inhaerere mansuris.<br /><br />May the mysteries we have celebrated,profit us, we pray, O Lord, for even now, as we journey<br />through this passing world, you teach us by them to love the things of heaven and hold fast to what will endure.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1015949969530867456.post-3287466692928574872011-11-27T21:02:15.777-05:002011-11-27T21:02:15.777-05:00Firm believer in lex orandi, lex credendi, lex viv...Firm believer in lex orandi, lex credendi, lex vivendi. <br /><br />So as we pray do we believe, and as we believe do we live.Adriennehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01562944653624224107noreply@blogger.com