Sunday, December 29, 2013

Being Schooled by Mark Shea Readers

I learned some very interesting concepts from Mark Shea readers yesterday that I thought I'd pass on to TTC readers.

Boy, they really have the pins for Voris.

One gentleman was honking his horn for his holy crusades against Michael for organizing a week long event of prayer, evangelization, Sacred Scripture and the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass during Lent, and having the nerve to call it a "retreat".

Leading a holy crusade against a man who organized an event where Catholics prayed and ate from a midnight buffet during Lent is his contribution to Christ's Church.

And here we were thinking chivalry is all but dead in Catholic men.

I asked a few questions to try to get a handle on why they were indignant and the fur started to fly. I was told women ought not to be 'splaining theology or the needs of the community to men - a woman's role is making men coffee.

Somewhere there is a mandatum which dictates that Catholics can't eat from buffets during Lent because (they claim) the Catechism requires Catholics only eat one meal a day for all 40 days during Lent and eating from a buffet is one of the seven deadly sins - gluttony.

You read that right. The Catechism says we can only have one meal a day during the entire 40 days of Lent and eating said meal from a buffet is the sin of gluttony.

As far as I know it says neither.

Anyone know the number in the Catechism on prohibitions of buffets?

I'd like to see this for myself. Building doctrines on a sin of presumption isn't gelling for me.

That's not all. The Sheabots said Catholics who spend $1000 a week for room and board is bourgeois. (Really? I can hardly live at home on that.)

I mentioned I've been in the same room with Mark Shea at an event to hear an evangelist at a swanky hotel that cost several hundred dollars a plate. He was dressed in a tuxedo, his wife was wearing a lovely evening dress. When you include their hotel bill and plane fare to get to the hotel, it had to cost a couple of grand for a five hour evening and one meal.

They asked me if the event was called a 'retreat'. They explained it isn't bourgeois to spend a couple of grand to hear an evangelist and eat one meal in a swanky hotel so long as it isn't called a retreat.

Follow their logic so far? There's more.

They were all worked up because the retreat was on a boat that sails on the ocean.

I first explained that they might have a beef if Voris was holding the retreat at a casino, but it is perfectly acceptable to hold a retreat on a boat. I also made reference to the many retreat homes owned by religious priests, nuns that are oceanfront properties.

They explained that priests and nuns owning multimillion dollar properties on the ocean and holding retreats there is okay. Oceanfront homes are permanent fixtures. I presumed that to mean we cant pray in moving objects.

Should we stop praying the Rosary in the car until we get a hold of the encyclical?

Several of them grew frustrated with me, said I was a piece of work and stormed off. I don't know why. Can't a gal ask questions?

One of them came back later to demand I tell him where Mark has promulgated error. I mentioned the controversy over his heresy of universal salvation and empty hell.

This is where the theology got really interesting.

They explained that because Balthasar was nominated for a red hat by Pope John Paul II, his heresy then became Church teaching. Otherwise, Pope John Paul II is a heretic. They had news for me they said - Church teaching evolves.

Yeah? Well, until it evolves into the Catechism, everything every episcopal luminary says actually isn't Church teaching.

Balthasar was a Jesuit. What a rotten vine that order has become. A gift that keeps on giving.

And they wonder why faithful Catholics are up in arms that Pope Francis dismantling of the Franciscan Friars of the Immaculate instead of the Jesuits?

From Scripture:

And I saw a great white throne, and one sitting upon it, from whose face the earth and heaven fled away, and there was no place found for them. And I saw the dead, great and small, standing in the presence of the throne, and the books were opened; and another book was opened, which is the book of life; and the dead were judged by those things which were written in the books, according to their works. And the sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and hell gave up their dead that were in them; and they were judged every one according to their works. And hell and death were cast into the pool of fire. This is the second death. And whosoever was not found written in the book of life, was cast into the pool of fire.

From the Catechism:

1022 Each man receives his eternal retribution in his immortal soul at the very moment of his death, in a particular judgment that refers his life to Christ: either entrance into the blessedness of heaven-through a purification or immediately, -- or immediate and everlasting damnation.

1034 of the Catechism of the Catholic Church: Jesus often speaks of "Gehenna" of "the unquenchable fire" reserved for those who to the end of their lives refuse to believe and be converted, where both soul and body can be lost.614 Jesus solemnly proclaims that he "will send his angels, and they will gather . . . all evil doers, and throw them into the furnace of fire,"615 and that he will pronounce the condemnation: "Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire!"616

1035 of the Catechism of the Catholic Church: The teaching of the Church affirms the existence of hell and its eternity. Immediately after death the souls of those who die in a state of mortal sin descend into hell, where they suffer the punishments of hell, "eternal fire."617 The chief punishment of hell is eternal separation from God, in whom alone man can possess the life and happiness for which he was created and for which he longs.

Further - Pope Benedict never taught contrary to Christ's Church relative to the day of final judgment when souls are sent to hell.

Pope Benedict XVI: "Jesus came to tell us that he wants us all in heaven and that hell, of which so little is said in our time, exists and is eternal for those who close their hearts to his love.

To apply this concept properly - one has to separate immortal souls from the living and the dead.

For immortal souls who are no longer among the living, the day of judgment according to his works was immediate upon their moment of death and for those who closed their hearts to His love, they have been sentenced to everlasting damnation in hell.

Consequently, it is not empty and it never will be empty.

For immortal souls among the living, we do hope and pray for the conversion of hardened hearts and deeply desire they will spend their eternity in paradise. But, we do not sew seeds of confusion about the choices one has to make to obtain that reward as that is counterproductive to the end we desire.


Anonymous said...

Carol, Shea has banned so many of his respondents that he has created a near-perfect echo chamber. The only way anybody stays if if they agree with El Commandante 24/7/365.

Anonymous said...

BTW, under which of his blog posts did you respond? I want to see the evidence for myself.

Anonymous said...

A retreat " a place of privacy or safety" I wish Voris God's Protection and all those with him !

TTC said...

Anon 6:27 - 2:09 and 10, I couldn't believe my eyes. They were like brainwashed zombies. When presented with questions they would be forced to answer that would unravel their twisted thoughts they refused and stormed off in a huff.

It wasn't on his blog. Email me and I'll give you the locus details.

Anon 627

They wouldn't admit that the substance of prayer, Scripture, lectures on how to advance or defend the faith and the Sacred Liturgy in near the ocean or mountains meets that definition.

It is irresponsible for his employers to know the damage he is doing to Catholics, the truth and the Church and continue to pay for his malicious dog fights against Catholics who teach the faith without error.

Steve Dalton said...

Shea's zombie's are trying to school you? The ignorant trying to leading the wise! LOL!

Caroline said...

This controversy over his(or anyone elses) heresy of universal salvation and empty hell, Balthasar...Church teaching evolves, etc...
comes straight from the pit of hell.

I better keep quiet though and just go make some coffee. +

TTC said...

Steve, we're all still learning. The process of finding out we are mistaken is a blessing.

But when you get to the point where you're arguing a concept that would make the crackpot theology of Bishop Gumbleton approbated because he was elevated to Bishop, you'd think your error would hit you right between the eyes.

Throwing grenades towards your informant under these circumstances seems really demonstrates the author of their logic and animus.

TTC said...

Nice to hear from you Caroline - Merry Christmas.

Yeah, it sure was a dance with the demons. I hope it woke a few of the zombies up but it seemed they were in too far over their heads. Perhaps we can fast for them.

TTC said...

ps - I'm out of coffee. Have a cup for me. LOL

Adrienne said...

OUT OF COFFEE???!!! Oooops - sorry for shouting, but those words are the worst of all words to read in the morning. Sending sympathy...

TTC said...

Ha. Thanks!

TTC said...

I sure could use a cup right now!!

Adrienne said...

Not to make it worse, buuuuuut we're on our second pot (and it's a 14 cup coffee maker.)

Anonymous said...

Carol, I suggest you read this, sign it, encourage others to do so and put it on your blog:

JB said...

Another error Shea literally has advocated for, and insulted those who took the contrary position outlined in Pius XII's Humani Generis. Yes, Pope Shea of the Sharp Tongue believes in polygenism and ridicules anyone who holds to the quaint silly old notion that mankind has two original parents. His mental and "theological" gymnastics on this topic were truly absurd to behold, and got me banned from his obnoxious blog.

Yes we're not allowed to pray on the ocean in moving objects. The authority for that is Mark Shea. That old prayer "O God you sea is so large and my boat so small" has been done away with.

Anonymous said...

"Being Schooled by Mark Shea Readers"

Carol, are you sure they know how to read? ;)

Anonymous said...

Petitioning EWTN/National Catholic Register: Reform or Remove Mark Shea

1st- With no formal education in theology or canon law, Mr. Shea presents himself as a qualified expert on the faith. The Catholic Church employs enough bishops, priests, deacons, and theology professors to articulate the faith without relying on untrained amateurs to publically represent our faith in the world.

2nd- Mr. Shea represents his own personal political opinions as official Church doctrine, only vaguely relating his own opinions to Church teaching. All to often, those political opinions include personal attacks on pro-lifers and outspoken conservative priests, expressed support for Islamic terrorists and gay priests, bashing our troops, and slander against anyone who expresses preference for a Latin Mass.

3. Mr. Shea publically slanders anyone with whom he disagrees(including priests in good standing) as anti-Semites, racists, rednecks, heretics, homophobes, and other slurs.

We are not asking that you terminate National Catholic Register/EWTN's association with Mr. Shea UNLESS he fails to respond to your repeated efforts to bring his work in line with Catholicism, in both content and tone. The ultimate hope is that his work will one day serve to fully reflect Catholic truth in content, tone, and focus.

TTC said...

He is incapable and unwilling to change. Been there done that. Consequently, he needs to be removed, IMO.

Beefy Levinson said...

I tried to leave a comment there today only to find that Shea has banned me. That's the third time he's done so over the years, by my count. Do I hold some kind of record?

TTC said...

LOL Beefy.

Congrats! I don't think you are the record holder. Hold onto the comment. The ban is only temporary. When his job is in jeopardy again he'll throw up a sob story with an apology.